GST 一站式問答

50912cmea

statement 发表于 26-8-2014 12:28 PM
如果我donation一笔钱出去, 然后有被报导, 那么这donation已产生benefit return效应, 那么我就需要缴交GST税务.  (这rules应该也可以apply在voucher, 因为很多商家会以voucher为卖点吸引顾客购物)

Supply (revised as at 25 October 2013)

Payments Which May Not Be Consideration

23. Payment received is not a consideration when there is no direct link between the payment and the supply or there is no supply of goods or services in return for the payment.

However, if there is a direct link between the payment and the supply or if there is a supply of goods or services in return for the payment, then such payment is a consideration for the supply and subject to GST.

(c) Monetary Donation

Monetary donation which is freely given with no expectation of anything in return is not a consideration for any supply. On the other hand, if the donor’s name is advertised in the newspaper in return for the monetary donation, the donor has received benefit from his donation. Therefore, his monetary donation is a consideration for the supply of the benefit to him in the form of the advertisement about him.

是不是 donee 从 donor 捐助的 amount 里倒算 GST portion 再上缴给症虎呢？

50912cmea

ManLoong 发表于 26-8-2014 01:18 PM
对不起，我 一般只参与对GST 指南解释或诠释较难的方面，没有刻意去把资料留底。 但估计在RMC 的 GENERAL ...

@Eva.acctg

在 Supply (revised as at 25 October 2013) Page 16 Mixed Supply

Mixed supply refers to a ‘multiple’ supply whose components are either of mixed liabilities (e.g. standard rated and exempt or standard rated and zero rated) or a mixture of both goods and services. The individual components are not integral to each other and are separate principal supplies. A trader makes a mixed supply where he charges a single inclusive price for a number of separate supplies of goods or services.

Example 12 (Page 22)
An insurance company is a mixed supplier, i.e. it supplies both general insurance (standard rated) and life insurance (exempt). The company purchased computer equipments to supply equally both the general insurance and life insurance policies and, therefore, was entitled to claim part (50%) of the input tax on the acquisition of the equipments. A few years later, the company disposes the computer equipments. The disposal of the equipments, whether or not for a consideration, is a supply of goods and subject to GST.

上面 bold 的都是 mixed supplier 吧？

vrz

coolly 发表于 26-8-2014 10:30 PM
不用乱和紧张，如果有需要帮忙可以找我，不然也可以购买GST的书先读获取知识。

可以问你老师，对 Tuition Center & Pharmacy 的看法吗？std rate / exempt supply / mixed supply ?

vrz

50912cmea 发表于 27-8-2014 12:41 AM
@Eva.acctg

在 Supply (revised as at 25 October 2013) Page 16 Mixed Supply

mixed supply 是 partial exemption trader，所以要背熟这个 guideline : Partial Exemption

vrz

50912cmea 发表于 27-8-2014 12:22 AM
Supply (revised as at 25 October 2013)

Payments Which May Not Be Consideration

给个 example 大家会比较容易参考，如 ：200-Plus 公司捐一笔钱出来赞助 (sponsor) 马拉松比赛，主办单位在参赛者衣服印上有关公司名字，收款者 就要从所得的款项算出 6% GST （tax fraction method = RM10k x 6/106 = RM566.04 GST).

而收款者（payee) 需要开 Tax Invoice 给 捐款者 （Payer），Payer 可以扣 input tax.

所谓的 Tax Invoice 是什么呢？。。。。。就是 Self-billed tax invoice

statement

50912cmea 发表于 27-8-2014 12:22 AM
Supply (revised as at 25 October 2013)

Payments Which May Not Be Consideration

这个要问kastam了, 不过以常理来说, 应该是donor承担吧. (如果donee是像星洲之类的代理, 或许就是donee承担了)

chongws

vrz 发表于 26-8-2014 08:25 PM
可以【自愿】注册，但是要保持2年才可以 cancel. 注册后，可以回扣买货和开销的 GST，当然也要 charge 客 ...

公司所有买进的货物，都能获得回扣？？？？

statement

vrz 发表于 27-8-2014 01:47 AM
给个 example 大家会比较容易参考，如 ：200-Plus 公司捐一笔钱出来赞助 (sponsor) 马拉松比赛，主办单位 ...

现在Kastam好像还没明确指示售价是inclusive 或exclusive, 所以那6% GST可以是收款者承担(inclusive), 也可以是捐款者承担(exclusive)

inclusive => RM10k x 6/106 = RM566.04
exclusive => RM10k x 6 = RM600

另外, Self-billed tax invoice不是谁想开就可以开的, 好像是需要申请并经过kastam准许.

jaiceling

vrz 发表于 25-8-2014 08:17 PM
普通注册，三天工作日可以拿到，但是 Group Register 听讲需要3个月时间，因为要一个个 检查member of gr ...

好的

谢谢你哦

50912cmea

vrz 发表于 27-8-2014 01:33 AM
mixed supply 是 partial exemption trader，所以要背熟这个 guideline : Partial Exemption

Partial Exemption (revised as at 4 November 2013) Page 3

A person who makes both taxable and exempt supplies is known as mixed supplier.

只要有 interest income 和 foreign exchange gain or loss 都中了！

50912cmea

ManLoong 发表于 26-8-2014 05:24 PM
原来有一个Healthcare Guideline 是在今年6月份发出的。按这个指南，前面的讨论就要修改了，那些开店面的 ...

不在 RCM Industry Guides 的 web page as at 26-8-2014, 所以不懂是不是 finalised 了。。。

其他网站的：http://www.princecourt.com/wp-content/uploads/GST.pdf

任何网友采用以上网站的资料，请自负法律责任！建议业者有疑问可以直接向 RMC 查询。

50912cmea

50912cmea 发表于 26-8-2014 02:14 AM
@vrz
@ManLoong
@statement

Retailing (revised as at 30 December 2013)

Figure 8 on Page 26

50912cmea

@statement
@keatlim77
@vrz
@ManLoong

大大们，请看楼上 Figure 8 on Page 26

Retailing (revised as at 30 December 2013)

一个 supply of "intended and underlying" goods or services, 有三个 parties, i.e. issuer, customer and redeemer 和三个 events as below:

1. Supply of cash voucher for cash or free by issuer to customer;
2. Supply of "intended and underlying" goods or services by redeemer to customer; and
3. Supply of cash voucher for cash by redeemer to issuer

只是一个 supply of "intended and underlying" goods or services, because of "voucher type arrangement" 而衍生出三个 supply transactions which are or are potentially subject to GST...double or even triple GST...

如果大大们是 tax authorities, 您们会怎么做 GST treatments 呢？

In order to avoid double/triple GST, 两个 events 必须被 disregarded. Here the RCM guide explains as "for the purpose of avoiding double taxation".

So, the next question? 那两个 events 被 disregarded 呢？

因为 cash coupon and cash 都是 medium of exchange, 所以应该是 events 1 and 3.

Here RCM explains as cash voucher, which is also a monetary voucher (face-value) is treated as a medium of exchange, and therefore the supply of monetary vouchers (events 1 and 3) is disregarded. (Here, it is up to your personal opinion as to whether the supply is disregarded as taxable supply or is treated as out of supply scope). Eventually, the GST is accountable on event 2.  

因为 events 是顺序和 GST treatments 出现在 events 1 and 2 了，所以 event 3 可以被不提 and so the double taxation avoidance was mentioned only.

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至于如何把 GST treatments on "supply of cash voucher for goods or services as free gift, i.e. event 1" fits into Scope of Supply 的 tests 里？

1) No consideration >> not a supply >> deemed supply? >> if no >> outside scope of supply

2) No consideration >> not a supply >> deemed supply? >> if yes >> within scope of supply, however for the purpose of avoiding double taxation on the supply and redemption of voucher, the supply of the voucher is disregarded up to the face value of the voucher. The seller or supplier of the voucher does not need to account GST on the voucher sold at or below the face value or given without consideration.

50912cmea

Retailing (revised as at 30 December 2013)

Figure 9 on Page 30

50912cmea

@statement
@keatlim77
@vrz
@ManLoong

大大们，现在来看。。。Supply and redemption of non-monetary voucher, 请看楼上 Figure 9 on Page 30

一个 supply of "intended and underlying" goods or services, 有三个 parties, i.e. issuer, customer and redeemer 和三个 events as below:

1. Supply of non-monetary voucher for cash or free by issuer to customer;
2. Supply of "intended and underlying" goods or services by redeemer to customer; and
3. Supply of non-monetary voucher for cash by redeemer to issuer

同样的。。。只是一个 supply of "intended and underlying" goods or services 衍生出三个 supply transactions which are or are potentially subject to GST...

therefore in order to avoid more than 1 time of GST, 两个 events 必须被 disregarded. 那两个呢？

However...没有了 "cash coupon is medium of exchange" 的 exclusion 理由，GST is accountable on event 1 instead. Events 2 and 3 are disregarded for GST purpose.

请看 Valuation (revised as at 21 March 2014) Page 26

48. The sale of non-monetary voucher which is redeemable for goods or services is as a supply of services. GST should be charged when such voucher is sold. When the non-monetary voucher is redeemed for a goods or services, no GST is due on the redemption. In the event that the supply of goods or services requires additional cash to top up the voucher, the additional cash payment is subjected to GST.

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如何把 GST treatments on "supply of (non-monetary voucher for goods only) as free gift, i.e. event 1" fits into Scope of Supply 的 tests 里？

1) No consideration >> not a supply >> deemed supply? >> if no (i.e. gift rule <500) >> outside scope of supply

2) No consideration >> not a supply >> deemed supply? >> if yes (i.e. gift rule >500) >> within scope of supply and subject to GST

请看 Page 29 of Retailing guide revised as at 30 December 2013

(b) Non-monetary voucher for goods (redeem for goods)

(ii) If the issuance of a non-monetary voucher is made without a consideration, the issuance of the voucher is subject to the gift rule. If the value of the goods stated in the voucher is more than RM500, the issuance of the voucher is subject to GST. If the value of the goods is up to RM500, the issuance of the voucher is not subject to GST. For example, a business issues a gift voucher for free to its customers to promote his business. The gift voucher states the bearer is entitled to a glass mug with a value of RM10.00. The issuance of such voucher is not subject to GST.

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不过，有个问题在 "supply of (non-monetary voucher for services only) as free gift, i.e. event 1"

请看 Page 29 of Retailing guide revised as at 30 December 2013

(a) Non-monetary voucher for services (redeem for services)

(ii) If the issuance of a non-monetary voucher for services is made without any consideration, the issuance of the voucher is not a supply and no GST is chargeable. For example, a business issues free cinema tickets to its customers.

难道 gift rule only applies to physical goods?

Gift rule in GST Act 2014 as below:

5. (1) Subject to subparagraph (2), where goods forming part of the assets of a business are transferred or disposed of by or under the directions of the person carrying on the business so as no longer to form part of those assets, whether or not for a consideration, the transfer or disposal is a supply of goods by the person.

(2) Subparagraph (1) does not apply where the transfer or disposal is -
(a) a gift of goods made in the course or furtherance of the business made to the same person in the same year where the total cost to the donor is not more than five hundred ringgit; or


那 for non-monetary voucher for services only as free gift, where should the GST be accounted for 呢？Retailing guide revised as at 30 December 2013 里没讲明！ 难道是漏洞？

ManLoong

50912cmea 发表于 27-8-2014 12:52 PM
不在 RCM Industry Guides 的 web page as at 26-8-2014, 所以不懂是不是 finalised 了。。。
...

对，这是正确做法，我们只能提供general advice, 没有收费，所以最下面那行是友情提醒。

bwei

50912cmea 发表于 27-8-2014 01:01 PM
@statement
@keatlim77
@vrz

If the issuance of a non-monetary voucher for services is made without any consideration, the issuance of the voucher is not a supply and no GST is chargeable. For example, a business issues free cinema tickets to its customers.

难道 gift rule only applies to physical goods?


如果是那样，那么餐厅是不是service？ （如果不是，当初就不应该归类收service tax）
那么换句话说，如果免费提供餐厅 non-monetary voucher / free meal 就应该是 not a supply 也不应该成为 deem supply， 对吗？

coolly

vrz 发表于 27-8-2014 01:27 AM
可以问你老师，对 Tuition Center & Pharmacy 的看法吗？std rate / exempt supply / mixed supply ? :ha ...

tuition centre应该会比较明显是 standard rated, 因为大部分你都不会在教育法令下注册，pharmacy我觉得还是有点争议，所以要等最后的 exempt order才能确定。

coolly

50912cmea 发表于 27-8-2014 12:50 PM
Partial Exemption (revised as at 4 November 2013) Page 3

A person who makes both taxable and ex ...

要一起跟别的guide读，只要不是 financial institution, interest income这些属于 incidental exempt supplies, 不会造成一间公司变成mixed supplier.

vrz

50912cmea 发表于 27-8-2014 01:01 PM
@statement
@ManLoong
@Aquariel

难道 gift rule only applies to physical goods?

就是这个，我很想弄清楚。我知道 Supply 【free service】 to connected person 是要算 GST，但是有规定多少钱吗？它是不是 under Gift rule 限定在 RM500？

如果 Gift rule 这是 for gift on goods，那么以下的 【gift on service】要怎样诠释 ？

我手上有两本书有关 【free service】，有两个答案，想问大家的意见 ：
1）一间足疗公司，每个星期去老人院提供免费足疗按摩，算 GST吗？
答案：有，虽然服务不是“卖”出去，而是捐出去，但只要服务提供出去，供应就构成了。
（虽然 supply 产生了，但不是也要看 consideration 吗 ？）

2）在按摩院消费4次以上，赠送免费颈项和肩膀按摩，这赠送要算 GST吗？
答案：没有，因为是 Gift of service (not goods) so no subject to GST.

两个都是大同小异的 free service，为什么两个不同答案 ？

谢谢讨论。