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刚刚看到这个资料从网站。。

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发表于 30-8-2012 02:24 PM | 显示全部楼层 |阅读模式
刚刚看到这个资料从网站。。
Piggyback ECUs are Bad for Your Health
I took apart an engine last weekend from an IS300 that literally torched a piston.  It had a turbo on a stock engine (2JZ) with a piggyback ecu (engine control unit).  No names, but it starts with a big "E" and it can't really manage.  If you haven't figured it out, the brand starts with a big "G".  If you still can't figure it out, then just add "reddy" to the end.  I usually define a piggyback ecu as anything that does not control ALL fuel and timing outputs.

Piggyback ecus (SHIT) by nature are incapable of controlling a modern day OBD2 ecu with highly adaptive fuel and ignition correction routines.  SHIT ecus generally attempt to enrich or enlean the final fuel output by tricking the stock ecu's air flow meter or pressure sensor voltage.  This is fine and dandy, but if you tweak your air flow setting, you are also tweaking the timing at the same time (not good).  To make things worse, the stock ecu takes readings from your O2 sensors and slowly trims the fuel map to change the fuel output to match what it is SUPPOSED to be.  To make things even more worse, many of the newer engines come with wideband O2s so now the correction ranges are much broader and corrections occur even faster.  What does this mean to you?  It means that you should unplug that SHIT ecu and sell it to some cheap f*ck on Ebay.  Are you a cheap f*ck?  No? Then take that piece of SHIT piggyback out of your car.

Some SHIT ecus actually control your coils/ignitors which is a general step in the right direction.  However, some of the shittier piggybacks just trick the stock ecu by retarding or advancing the cam/crank triggers to retard or advance timing.  Newer OBD2 ecus are highly adaptive with ignition too.  The stock ecu takes a knock count from the knock sensor and continually retards timing until there is no knock.  It then continually tries to advance the timing to optimize emissions and power.  Over time, if the stock ecu senses that it cannot advance the timing, a long term trim value is "remembered" and the ecu will attempt to advance the timing less often and in smaller increments.  This is great feature in a bone stock car and can save an engine.  It sucks ass when you bolt a turbo on to your non turbo car.  Why?  Because chances are if you're running a SHIT ecu, the A/F ratio  is lean.  When the fuel is lean the knock count goes up.  Sure, the engine no longer knocks with the stock ecu retarding timing, but with the ignition super retarded, the exhaust gas temperatures skyrocket.  When that happens, you crack a piston, torch a piston, torch a valve, destroy the head, destroy the block, break/melt a spark plug or any combination of these.

For those piggybacks that control timing independently of the stock ecu, guess what?  Those are f*cked too.  When on the dyno or initially tuning a SHIT ecu, there are no long term fuel corrections in "memory".  But after your tuning session, you'll start driving around on the street and putting miles on the car.  Since I doubt your so called tuner spent 15 hours mapping, chances are he did not match the factory ecu's air fuel ratios exactly and the stock ecu will develop a long term fuel trim that globally affects the overall fuel output.  At the same time, every time you floor the engine and the O2 sensors are reading pig rich, the stock ecu is also attempting to lean out the A/F ratio and will also add to the long term fuel corrections.  Over time, your engine will be running leaner than crap.  And what about your timing map?  You bet your ass you didn't trim it at the same time the A/F ratio was going leaner and leaner.  You will more than likely break your engine in the ways I mentioned above.

When you get serious about horsepower and reliability, stick to these options with PROFESSIONAL tuning.  Stay away from those internet tuners who do not have a place of business.  Why?  Because when he leaves town and something is not right with your car - you're f*cked.

Standalone ECU (Apex Power FC, HKS V-Pro, Motec, Haltech, Hydra, etc.)

Factory ECU with reflash (by a professional)

Factory ECU with reflash module (Cobb, Diablo, Sniper, etc.)

If you have a normally aspirated engine, then a piggyback is OK.  Or if you have a turbo and are running like 2-3psi, then you're probably OK too, but who does this anymore?  The bottom line is that the only correct way to control your engine is with ABSOLUTE control.  That simply is not possible with any piggyback (SHIT) ecu.

AEM has taken a step in the right direction with their piggyback where you can send a mappable dummy output signal to the factory ecu's O2 sensor inputs.  This definitely helps to prevent the short/long term fuel trims from getting too out of hand, but why not just spend the extra money and do it right?  Your engine and wallet will appreciate it in the long run.


Lexus IS300 2JZ-GE torched piston.


The piston was literally torched and here you can see the molten aluminum along the beam of the rod.  This guy will spend $15k on a built engine and another $5k on an HKS V-Pro to do it right this time.  He only needed to spend $5k in the beginning and he would have saved $15k.  Relatively speaking, that's cheap insurance.  Nobody said playing with cars was cheap!

http://www.motoiq.com/magazine_articles/id/1090/piggyback-ecus-are-bad-for-your-health.aspx


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 楼主| 发表于 30-8-2012 02:26 PM | 显示全部楼层
那么如果用 EMS / E-manage 来remaping ECU会使engine坏吗??
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发表于 30-8-2012 02:38 PM | 显示全部楼层
@周杰论
你看看。。。
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发表于 30-8-2012 02:55 PM | 显示全部楼层
太长了,请问到底在讲什么事情?
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发表于 30-8-2012 03:41 PM | 显示全部楼层
Firecow00 发表于 30-8-2012 02:55 PM
太长了,请问到底在讲什么事情?

我只看得懂piggyback 对健康不好~其他不懂在说什么
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发表于 30-8-2012 03:51 PM | 显示全部楼层
太长了~重点是什么?
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发表于 30-8-2012 03:55 PM 来自手机 | 显示全部楼层
重点是LEXUS IS300 不适合remaping ECU。
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发表于 30-8-2012 04:55 PM | 显示全部楼层
重点是piggyback 会增加车的power,让司机长期有G force 的压力,让人不健康。
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发表于 30-8-2012 05:02 PM | 显示全部楼层
很明显。。。他的E-manage是让了不会的人来tune才搞成这样。。。。我很多朋友下track的车用了都没事。。。
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发表于 30-8-2012 07:02 PM | 显示全部楼层
MW112 发表于 30-8-2012 02:38 PM
@周杰论
你看看。。。

我看不懂哈哈,你解释给我听好了
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发表于 30-8-2012 07:03 PM | 显示全部楼层
~jack~ 发表于 30-8-2012 02:26 PM
那么如果用 EMS / E-manage 来remaping ECU会使engine坏吗??

我用ems接近一年了呵呵
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发表于 31-8-2012 11:32 AM | 显示全部楼层
周杰论 发表于 30-8-2012 07:02 PM
我看不懂哈哈,你解释给我听好了

简单来讲,他是说他换了piggy back remapped ECU后,他的车炸了。。。


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发表于 31-8-2012 12:03 PM | 显示全部楼层
他应该要讲piggy back是不好的吧
我觉得还是用回原装的tuner来调比较好
如wira的PDT2000或lancer/inspira的MUTIII
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发表于 31-8-2012 12:49 PM | 显示全部楼层
这个是tuner的问题吧,跟piggyback有关系咩
tune不对,over了piston可以handle的范围当然会炸咯
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发表于 31-8-2012 12:52 PM | 显示全部楼层
大肥叔 发表于 30-8-2012 05:02 PM
很明显。。。他的E-manage是让了不会的人来tune才搞成这样。。。。我很多朋友下track的车用了都没事。。。{ ...

tuner的问题也可以讲成是piggy back的问题,厉害下

我朋友的车很多都是unchip和emanage不见得会炸
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发表于 31-8-2012 06:32 PM | 显示全部楼层
小恋人 发表于 31-8-2012 12:52 PM
tuner的问题也可以讲成是piggy back的问题,厉害下

我朋友的车很多都是unchip和emanage不见得会炸 ...

就是咯那个根本就是自己弄坏了才在那边哭爸哭妈
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 楼主| 发表于 1-9-2012 09:45 AM | 显示全部楼层
周杰论 发表于 30-8-2012 06:03 PM
我用ems接近一年了呵呵


你是用在proton的车??
好用吗??
会觉得比较有力和省油吗??
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发表于 1-9-2012 10:50 AM | 显示全部楼层
~jack~ 发表于 1-9-2012 09:45 AM
你是用在proton的车??
好用吗??
会觉得比较有力和省油吗??

真的很省油,不得你不信,力呢?没什么差
比较容易上7k转,开了rev cut,底转就明显比较有力、
上dyno之前5.5k转开始power drop了,
他帮我调到力水上到7k转,
我的是campro kosong satria neo
上了10个马左右
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发表于 1-9-2012 11:23 AM | 显示全部楼层
調不好 e-manage 變成 e-damage
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 楼主| 发表于 1-9-2012 12:04 PM | 显示全部楼层
周杰论 发表于 1-9-2012 09:50 AM
真的很省油,不得你不信,力呢?没什么差
比较容易上7k转,开了rev cut,底转就明显比较有力、
上dyno之 ...


你的是Manual ??
如果我的auto persona IAFM 装了不懂会如何。。
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